Comments on: Windows Has Been Collapsing For Years http://blog.isecore.net/2008/04/14/windows-has-been-collapsing-for-years/ Authentic Frontier Gibberish Fri, 29 Aug 2008 22:01:58 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v= By: isecore http://blog.isecore.net/2008/04/14/windows-has-been-collapsing-for-years/#comment-114685 isecore Wed, 16 Apr 2008 16:42:25 +0000 http://blog.isecore.net/?p=1934#comment-114685 I remember reading articles and opinion-pieces in computer-magazines way back in the early '90s, saying that IBM/Microsoft/etc should ditch the legacy-hardware as well as software. The authors maintained that the PC as it was then was completely antiquated and that the then-powerful 486s had no problem emulating the legacy if needed. I always felt that was what they should've done, but it never happened. PC's grew to be hundreds of thousands of times more powerful, yet they still always had their feet in the x86-legacy. I remember reading articles and opinion-pieces in computer-magazines way back in the early ’90s, saying that IBM/Microsoft/etc should ditch the legacy-hardware as well as software. The authors maintained that the PC as it was then was completely antiquated and that the then-powerful 486s had no problem emulating the legacy if needed.

I always felt that was what they should’ve done, but it never happened. PC’s grew to be hundreds of thousands of times more powerful, yet they still always had their feet in the x86-legacy.

]]> By: Mind http://blog.isecore.net/2008/04/14/windows-has-been-collapsing-for-years/#comment-114675 Mind Wed, 16 Apr 2008 15:29:36 +0000 http://blog.isecore.net/?p=1934#comment-114675 I also feel that a fresh start with an emulator-mode for old legacy software would be the best way to go. Especially if the emulating-mode is optional during installation and is available for install later should you ever need it. At first there would surely be a lot of games that suffered because of imperfect emulation and the loss of speed. Both of those problem would slowly get better, at least until no one cared any longer about those old games. Seriously though, how many of you still play dos-games on a regular basis? I also feel that a fresh start with an emulator-mode for old legacy software would be the best way to go. Especially if the emulating-mode is optional during installation and is available for install later should you ever need it. At first there would surely be a lot of games that suffered because of imperfect emulation and the loss of speed. Both of those problem would slowly get better, at least until no one cared any longer about those old games. Seriously though, how many of you still play dos-games on a regular basis?

]]> By: isecore http://blog.isecore.net/2008/04/14/windows-has-been-collapsing-for-years/#comment-114636 isecore Wed, 16 Apr 2008 08:41:07 +0000 http://blog.isecore.net/?p=1934#comment-114636 Henka: What Harri said was that Microsoft should start fresh with a new codebase, and use emulation for legacy-stuff. Games would simply have to adapt, unless a solution can be find whereas code for the legacy-system (where games would fall) can be adapted to either the new system, or where the legacy-system can support such applications. I'd say it's a far from perfect solution, but of the choices available to Microsoft this would be the most painful for them. It would still mean alienating most of the users, but it would allow Microsoft to keep some backwards compatibility with legacy-software while still starting fresh. Essentially it would be the same thing that Apple did when they introduced OSX, yet had OS9 baked into it to support legacy-applications that wouldn't or couldn't be ported to the new codebase. Henka: What Harri said was that Microsoft should start fresh with a new codebase, and use emulation for legacy-stuff. Games would simply have to adapt, unless a solution can be find whereas code for the legacy-system (where games would fall) can be adapted to either the new system, or where the legacy-system can support such applications.

I’d say it’s a far from perfect solution, but of the choices available to Microsoft this would be the most painful for them. It would still mean alienating most of the users, but it would allow Microsoft to keep some backwards compatibility with legacy-software while still starting fresh.

Essentially it would be the same thing that Apple did when they introduced OSX, yet had OS9 baked into it to support legacy-applications that wouldn’t or couldn’t be ported to the new codebase.

]]> By: henka http://blog.isecore.net/2008/04/14/windows-has-been-collapsing-for-years/#comment-114619 henka Wed, 16 Apr 2008 05:50:35 +0000 http://blog.isecore.net/?p=1934#comment-114619 Harri: that might work for office applications but what about all performance critical stuff, like games? I have yet to see a emulator run a game even remotely close to original performance (if they even have access to 3d acceleration). Backwards compability is really important for MS and their users and loosing that means utter doom for ms and their stockholders. Harri: that might work for office applications but what about all performance critical stuff, like games?

I have yet to see a emulator run a game even remotely close to original performance (if they even have access to 3d acceleration).

Backwards compability is really important for MS and their users and loosing that means utter doom for ms and their stockholders.

]]> By: harri http://blog.isecore.net/2008/04/14/windows-has-been-collapsing-for-years/#comment-114433 harri Tue, 15 Apr 2008 00:05:15 +0000 http://blog.isecore.net/?p=1934#comment-114433 Microsoft can buy a new system and port vpc for legacy support Microsoft can buy a new system and port vpc for legacy support

]]> By: isecore http://blog.isecore.net/2008/04/14/windows-has-been-collapsing-for-years/#comment-114272 isecore Mon, 14 Apr 2008 13:01:32 +0000 http://blog.isecore.net/?p=1934#comment-114272 You put too much faith in Windows 7. It won't be anything more than yet another rehash of the same codebase. I find it very difficult to imagine Microsoft managing to actually make something that provides real, genuine incentive to upgrade rather than artificially forcing the users. As for Mac, what you're talking about wasn't emulation, it was a complete installation of OS9 wrapped inside OS X. It was provided as a way to run legacy-applications inside OS X. The concept died when Apple left the PPC-platform and switched to Intel, since there's no Intel-version of the legacy MacOS available. You put too much faith in Windows 7. It won’t be anything more than yet another rehash of the same codebase. I find it very difficult to imagine Microsoft managing to actually make something that provides real, genuine incentive to upgrade rather than artificially forcing the users.

As for Mac, what you’re talking about wasn’t emulation, it was a complete installation of OS9 wrapped inside OS X. It was provided as a way to run legacy-applications inside OS X. The concept died when Apple left the PPC-platform and switched to Intel, since there’s no Intel-version of the legacy MacOS available.

]]> By: henka http://blog.isecore.net/2008/04/14/windows-has-been-collapsing-for-years/#comment-114217 henka Mon, 14 Apr 2008 11:27:27 +0000 http://blog.isecore.net/?p=1934#comment-114217 Well written as always. but Ms is in a bad situation today, they will sink if they don't change and sink IF they change. Change to a new kernel incompatible with current software (games etc) and no-one will see a reason to buy the "new" windows. They live because of compability. It sucks to buy a new computer with a new OS have nothing to do with it, no games, no word etc. Vista still runs all my games and apps (well, most of the apps). OSX managed this by having OS9 emulated (or was it even older os versions?) in a wmvare like environment. but can this be done for windows, esp with today's requirement in performance? If windows NewEdition comes out, and none of my apps/games work. I might just as well stay with XP or go on the ubuntu band-wagon. This is where MS looses out. A lot of corporations uses programs limited to old versions of windows and with to few users to make it feasible to rewrite those, sometimes large, programs. And they might just as well drop MS altogether if this happens and go with osx or linux. I hope windows 7 will do more then xp->vista did, both for MS and myself. I can not stand linux today, guess I'm incompatible with it. Or i should just forget about gaming on PC and stick to proprietary systems like my newly bought PS3. MS will need to take the hit, just like apple did. They will probably loose money for the stock owners but they can afford it. Well written as always.

but Ms is in a bad situation today, they will sink if they don’t change and sink IF they change. Change to a new kernel incompatible with current software (games etc) and no-one will see a reason to buy the “new” windows. They live because of compability. It sucks to buy a new computer with a new OS have nothing to do with it, no games, no word etc. Vista still runs all my games and apps (well, most of the apps). OSX managed this by having OS9 emulated (or was it even older os versions?) in a wmvare like environment. but can this be done for windows, esp with today’s requirement in performance?

If windows NewEdition comes out, and none of my apps/games work. I might just as well stay with XP or go on the ubuntu band-wagon. This is where MS looses out. A lot of corporations uses programs limited to old versions of windows and with to few users to make it feasible to rewrite those, sometimes large, programs. And they might just as well drop MS altogether if this happens and go with osx or linux.

I hope windows 7 will do more then xp->vista did, both for MS and myself. I can not stand linux today, guess I’m incompatible with it.

Or i should just forget about gaming on PC and stick to proprietary systems like my newly bought PS3.

MS will need to take the hit, just like apple did. They will probably loose money for the stock owners but they can afford it.

]]> By: Anwin http://blog.isecore.net/2008/04/14/windows-has-been-collapsing-for-years/#comment-114194 Anwin Mon, 14 Apr 2008 10:50:44 +0000 http://blog.isecore.net/?p=1934#comment-114194 Damn...that was a damn good article. I still can't get over "damned if they do, damned if they don't". Maybe I should move to Mac too :) Damn…that was a damn good article. I still can’t get over “damned if they do, damned if they don’t”. Maybe I should move to Mac too :)

]]> By: isecore http://blog.isecore.net/2008/04/14/windows-has-been-collapsing-for-years/#comment-114137 isecore Mon, 14 Apr 2008 09:10:33 +0000 http://blog.isecore.net/?p=1934#comment-114137 I assure you, that computer is the only known somewhat working Windows ME-installation. It's the exception to the rule, and in the world of computing that system is a flying pig. I'm certain that even Microsoft themselves would be surprised to hear about an actual ME-installation that didn't need reinstalling every 2-3 weeks and doesn't bluescreen five-six times a day. I assure you, that computer is the only known somewhat working Windows ME-installation. It’s the exception to the rule, and in the world of computing that system is a flying pig.

I’m certain that even Microsoft themselves would be surprised to hear about an actual ME-installation that didn’t need reinstalling every 2-3 weeks and doesn’t bluescreen five-six times a day.

]]> By: Gam' Gubbe http://blog.isecore.net/2008/04/14/windows-has-been-collapsing-for-years/#comment-114098 Gam' Gubbe Mon, 14 Apr 2008 07:54:10 +0000 http://blog.isecore.net/?p=1934#comment-114098 Uh...I opened up my old IBM Thinkpad 380 Z, after a couple of years non-use. Surprisingly, the Windows Millennium program worked a smooth as silk. Isn't that a head-banger? Uh…I opened up my old IBM Thinkpad 380 Z, after a couple of years non-use. Surprisingly, the Windows Millennium program worked a smooth as silk. Isn’t that a head-banger?

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